Is making your sub cry considered "breaking" a sub?

[Guest]

I've made my submissives cry in session before, but I don't know if that is the same as breaking them.

 

Have you ever felt like you've been "broken"? How did it happen? How did it make you feel? Did you *want* to be broken by that person? in that way? What happened afterwards?

[Guest]

The Stanger has never been broken . But I would enjoy hearing one of your stories, of how you broke someone...maybe I'd let ya try to corral this poney

[Big Trouble Baby]

I've made my submissives cry in session before, but I don't know if that is the same as breaking them.

 

Have you ever felt like you've been "broken"? How did it happen? How did it make you feel? Did you *want* to be broken by that person? in that way? What happened afterwards?

 

 

Mistress Kang:

 

I was just thinking of this recently as I contemplate my upcoming session with Ms Zhao. I plan to ask her about crying. I would think if someone were brought to tears but continued to take punishment it wouldn't be "breaking" them. If someone begged or demanded you stop even if they didn't cry I think that might qualify as being "broken". I look forward to the opinions of more seasoned pro's on this and your other questions.

 

Ray

[fistluvr]

I have never been broken as you describe, although I have cried in a session before. For me "Broken" would be a kind of mind control process from some sort of long term sensory deprivation and hypnotic, emotional and physical torture in which I was persuaded to give over total control to my mistress. My mind completely crushed and my life completely in her control perhaps with her using some form of abandonment/exile treatment in which I felt my only recourse was to completely give up everything for her. Of course I could picture some form of highly erotic and sensual play at the end of the process to soothe me and reinforce the bond.

 

For me that sounds very scary and would place me in a highly coercive situation, but at the same time I have to say I am oddly drawn to the total destructive nature of that scenario. I find my heart pounding at the thought of that! Thank you for introducing that thought!

[monokuro]

Mistress Kang,

 

From my experiences I think being considered "broken" is a loss of all resistance and an increase of acceptance over the dominance that is occurring. Of course, one should note that tears are not always a definite sign since they could be tears of joy (strange yes, but that could happen) or crocodile tears hiding laughter (I don't break easily, I bend). I remember once being broken (first S&M experience) and it felt like I had hit the ground from three feet up, I guess it could be described as 'All control over this situation has been lost, oh dear.' But that time I did feel a need to show someone I had feelings for that I was actually fragile on the inside, although I didn't know it would happen with such intensity and ferocity.

 

Hope this helps, Mistress.

[Hound_Dog]

Dear Ms. Kang,

 

I'm sure that would make it all to easy, it would be equally unfair to say that if he bleeds your been 'breaking" him. The term indicates wearing down his resistance, either to your authority (which I'm sure is considerable in first person, tied up or down with either an blindfolded, gag or both) or in an particular area of play.

 

I've been in sessions where I've seriously questioned what made me think this would be an good idea, and swore to myself to never return or contact the Mistress in question again, only to be back on the rack a few days later. It's the sessions that push you that you will remember, and if it's done right ( no serious injuries (make sure your accident insurance is current) or loss of body functions ) it's what you later will wish could happen again. ( yea yea YMMV )

 

Breaking should be thought of as breaking new ground, not in a body cast convalescence type of way. And please note that I'm not saying that body casts aren't the way to play, just remember that it's the journey that's the reward.

 

HD.

--

I can resist anything but temptation.

Oscar Wilde, Lady Windermere's Fan, 1892, Act I

Irish dramatist, novelist, & poet (1854 - 1900)

[whiplash]

I've made my submissives cry in session before, but I don't know if that is the same as breaking them.

 

Have you ever felt like you've been "broken"? How did it happen? How did it make you feel? Did you *want* to be broken by that person? in that way? What happened afterwards?

 

Mistress Kang,

 

i think it depends on the context, on the particular situation and the two people involved in the scene. Crying could result from being broken or they could be an expression of elation and extreme joy or even depression and sadness. Of course crying could be the climax of the breaking point as well. I can't say that I've ever been broken or that I have even cried in session, although I have come very close to each. I remember once that I was in a very intense relationship with a professional relationship that crossed boundaries into a more personal and lifestyle situation. She once whipped me beyond anything that she had given me before with an edge of hostility and mystery. It was an intensely emotional moment as well as incredibly physically demanding experience. Just before she stopped I was on the verge of tears and even madness. I felt like this was an ending for us and it hurt me deeply. At the same time I had intense submissive feelings and had felt like I had totally surrendered to her at that moment. That was as close to being broken that I've ever felt.

 

I'm sure others feel quite differently about it. I can't really say that I view being broken as being a positive experience but in a different context of a caring loving Domme perhaps it could be. I'd be interested to read what others have to say.

 

whip

[Dannyboy]

I've made my submissives cry in session before, but I don't know if that is the same as breaking them.

 

Have you ever felt like you've been "broken"? How did it happen? How did it make you feel? Did you *want* to be broken by that person? in that way? What happened afterwards?

 

Dear Mistress Kang:

 

Being broken is sometimes physical, sometimes emotional and often a combination of the two; I would describe it as being taken beyond limits within which you feel you still retain some control or command.

 

You broke me in August 2005 physically and you stopped because I was getting dizzy and felt faint. I would have endured anything just to be with you so it was ok with me. You took care of me by nursing me back to stability and we shared time to decompress and bond.

 

In our double session with my Tiny Dancer I was broken emotionally by her. My spirit just gave up and I felt total despondency. She relented in her cruelty and moved into a nurturing mode. You know that she has gone her own way and I no longer have those demons inside of me. We had a relationship that became deeply personal and intimate before and after that event. Eventually my tolerance for her wore out completely.

 

There was a double session with you and Vu during which I was broken once again. I don't think we've ever gone that far again.

 

There were other instances of being broken over a span of years with other Ladies and other circumstances but in my present circumstances the intensity of my play has abated.

 

Dannyboy

[spockme]

Dear Mistress Kang,

I believe that breaking a sub is only a mental function not a physical one One can cry from pain and not be broken .I remember when you had me with Mistress Kim and Chan . You wanted me to be tortured for something I wrote in the forum . You told me I probably would never see you again . I had to be punished for four hours to please The Mistresses. Well it was a relly tough session I was battered and had just about everything you can think of happen to me The CBT was very hard But towards the end I broke down because they under your instructions mentally tormented me in that I would not see you again this was hard to take as they increased the pain and told me i failed and it was over . Yes Minni tried to tell me when at the end that this was the greatest mind----- ever but i was brokened mentally. I could not even see you at the end as you wanted . I failed and was really hurt and defeated Yes I started crying from the mental anguish at the end/ . Minni was a great mental player . But I know Mental is different than physical crying and feeling

[magdiver]

I have never been with a Dominant, so my opinion on this isn't based on personal experience. My feeling is that "breaking" a sub is removing all barriers of resistance and self-protection, taking them to the point where they no longer resist or question their Mistress. If an order is given it is done immediately and without hesitation. It's a conditioning, first based on power, and then trust.

 

Crying is an indication that you've either exceeded a physical pain threshold or you have touched on a personal fear or frustration such as failure to succeed or please.

[forcedsuckboy]

It's about breaking the will. I grew up on a ranch, and a cowboy "breaks" a horse to tame him and make him ride-able. He's broken when he becomes fully controllable and compliant.

 

To me, it's when the sub gives up hope, understands that suffering is at hand and there's nothing he can do to stop it, and therefore fully accepts the need to obey every command completely and immediately.

 

I would think crying is the most extreme example of this, and an absolutely sure sign that one has been broken. I've never cried in a session (although I have very little experience), but in every bdsm fantasy I have, someone (usually me) bawls like a baby and begs for mercy.

 

Mistress Kang, the idea of you making men cry is very hot. Would love to hear any stories about this!

[lashee]

[noah]

I wouldn't consider crying to be synonymous with being broken. Crying is a form of resistance, or processing physical/emotional content under circumstances where other (more dignified) ways of processing just fail. If a slave cries, it can possibly mean that you're on the right track to breaking him, but not quite there yet. It can also be true that you could break a slave without ever making him cry. Each person is different.

 

As for what I would consider the "breaking point" however, that's difficult to say. Perhaps it's when he gives up resisting and just does everything you say without question, reason, or ration. Unequivocal mental and emotional control, as it were. I don't think it can be done in a session, or even in multiple sessions, but probably only in a 24/7. You have to know everything about your slave to do it, and dedicate a significant portion of your time. In principle, it's the same as brainwashing, and as a result, after enough time that he's regained freedom (probably a few weeks), he would not be under your control in the same way any more. What might be a more realistic goal for a session-by-session basis would be to break different aspects of a slave, such as specific inhibitions, ideals, or associations.

 

Be that as it may, I've felt completely broken by a girl who did absolutely nothing to me before. If looks could kill, you know...

[Big Trouble Baby]

Been thinking about this topic for some time. Have any subs requested to be brought to tears in a session? Have any Mistresses, within the parameters of the session, attempted to make a sub cry? This would include physical and/or mental torture.

 

Ray

[Big Trouble Baby]

Been thinking about this topic for some time. Have any subs requested to be brought to tears in a session? Have any Mistresses, within the parameters of the session, attempted to make a sub cry? This would include physical and/or mental torture.

 

Ray

 

Saw someone viewing this Topic and also saw I tried to revive it some time back. Maybe it's ready for a Revival now.

[Mistress Fei]

Saw someone viewing this Topic and also saw I tried to revive it some time back. Maybe it's ready for a Revival now.

 

I was in a session with a sub recently who said that crying to him was a release much like climaxing

 

To see tears in his eyes was very powerful and moving

[Sub_Hub]

I almost cried when I couldn't access the FF site the last 3 days. What was that about?

[Dashan]

Ah, the bliss that cathartic tears would be! The amount of corporal it takes to get there is perhaps disturbing to dommes without a generous sadistic streak.

 

To me, actual tears are the holy grail of a wonderful heavy corporal scene

[Howard]

Saw someone viewing this Topic and also saw I tried to revive it some time back. Maybe it's ready for a Revival now.

 

Crying is cathartic regardless of the motivation. Always has been, always will be.

 

While I had not cried in many years, I did so in my first Tran/Kang double domme session. It had nothing to do with physical pain, but everything to do with Mistress Kang's "I want to know a Secret game" which caused me to think about a serious hurt over 40 years ago. Bringing it back brought the tears. It was interesting. Pain the mind brings can be far more serious than any physical pain in my opinion.

 

I would be curious as to what others think. BTB thanks for bringing this current.

 

Howard

[skeech2]

Honestly, I struggle with the term "being broken". What is being broken? Is it will? If so, it does not seem to me that one can be broken if he willingly submits. I would venture to guess than an emotional experience producing tears during session is rooted in something other than the breaking of one's will.

[Manpeach]

For me the tears came later. The moment I broke is instilled into my brain like it was yesterday and will remain vivid for the rest of my life.

 

I was trying to untie a knot for Mistress Zhao. She kept whacking at my back with a riding crop trying to impress upon me the urgency of my success. In the end I failed at the knot. Mistress Zhao leaned down to look at me. “Are you crying ?” she asked.

“no” I replied, trying to hang on to some shred of dignity. It was fruitless. I was crying inside, a blubbering mess. My eyes had not yet started to tear up yet and I thought I could get away with it. I denied her the satisfaction of knowing I was really crying. That is the last time I said “no” Mistress Zhao.

 

[Big Trouble Baby]

Crying is cathartic regardless of the motivation. Always has been, always will be.

 

While I had not cried in many years, I did so in my first Tran/Kang double domme session. It had nothing to do with physical pain, but everything to do with Mistress Kang's "I want to know a Secret game" which caused me to think about a serious hurt over 40 years ago. Bringing it back brought the tears. It was interesting. Pain the mind brings can be far more serious than any physical pain in my opinion.

 

I would be curious as to what others think. BTB thanks for bringing this current.

 

Howard

 

You're welcome, Howard. I'm glad there were some responses and hope to see some more on this topic.

 

Ray

[Big Trouble Baby]

I once broke down and cried like a baby in a session with Mistress Zhao. It wasn't from her punishment, though. it was more from my mental state at the time. I came very close to crying in a session with another Mistress but I fought it off.

[Hound_Dog]

Honestly, I struggle with the term "being broken". What is being broken?

 

Hi Skeech,

 

This is an fairly deep and complex topic to cover, but your correct in that crying is neither the goal or how it is measured. But since you asked here is my 1円

 

To keep the discussion as light as possible, I will only outline this topic.

• You have breaking in, which is the willing consensual breaking in. Basically it is about establishing procedures, routines and setting expectations. This is teaching the expected result of commands etc.
  
• Forcefully Breaking on the other hand is about removing limits. It's very similar to animal training. It's about establishing authority. It's about shaping response and behavior until its within the required tolerance. The loss of power and to feel ones core being stripped away is sometimes what the submissive seeking this relish. But as this tend to make the subject extremely dependent on the top, seeking approval for all actions etc. it can be dangerous to the subs mental health.
  

 

Your correct in that if an individual have few limits, then breaking that person is more difficult. But most people have limits.

 

YMMV, stay healthy!

 

HD.

[Outcast]

I think there are different types of tears. Healthier tears are a release of sorts. Pent up emotions getting let out. Hearing a song ,or being reminded of something and if I have privacy I let it out.. For me,unhealthy tears are those that come from fear or anger which for me can be rooted in self pity, self loathing etc. I recently set up a session where I asked to be brought down that path. I was in a moodwhen I booked where I wanted to be hurt emotionally. It's kind of like a drunk starting a fight with a monster , self destruction ,wanting to get beaten down because you feel likrle shit about yourself and want to pay some kind of penance. Luckily,the Mistress knows me and understood that that kind of session isn't the best for me. She talked to me about it in some depth and I felt tears, but they were the healthy kind ( for me). And then we proceeded to have a great time!! That's my experience with crying during session. The trust and connection was powerful and beautiful.