Mistress Fei Posted March 18, 2015 Report Share Posted March 18, 2015 Hey everyone, Been thinking about my positionality in power relations It seems I prefer to turn the tables- underestimated at first and then at a specific moment flipping the power exchange- There's something so satisfying about the unexpectedness of it all- the other has become comfortable thinking he/she is in the position of power. It takes an initial, and quite uncomfortable investment of seeming less powerful at the outset, i would say that's the drawback It throws the other person off and it's quite a feat when accomplished correctly What are your thoughts on power, your preferred role of power- whether it be dominant/submissive? Do you prefer to always be in control (how do you go about maintaining your continual control?) or do you prefer a turn-the-tables scenario like I outlined above? Let me know why! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistress Fei Posted March 19, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 19, 2015 Right up my alley. I am not submissive by nature. I always need to be in control. But it is not an in your face form of control. Although when pushed I get there very quickly. But typically I like to be the under estimated guy in the background that appears harmless but is actually manipulating the outcome and controlling everything. It is like a game of chess. I am extraordinarily good at it and I love it. I must admit though that through my time at the Fortress I have learned to hone this skill for the greater good. And maybe a better word now is influence versus manipulate. So now I can do both. I feel a bit split though that in life I influence but at work I manipulate. It is the only way to survive global corporate culture. interesting- thought you'd like this question can you explain more re: influence vs manipulate? if i understand correctly, in this context influence means asserting power upfront while manipulating means pulling the strings in the background yeah? and, can you give me an example re: manipulating in the workplace? I'd love to hear more details Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
questionmarks Posted March 19, 2015 Report Share Posted March 19, 2015 Ah, Mistress Fei, sometimes reading your words is like hearing a part of me speaking to me from without, only with your mesmerizing visage and cute voice I'm like you! Here's how I do it: I often take a contrarian stance, put myself way out on a limb, and let the other person feel they've got me cornered, then I gently pull out the rug from underneath them by complicating the picture, and presenting my "out there" stance as a critique that, when properly understood, puts their view AND itself into question. Not sure that's a very clear description, but in any case you've already described it quite well. I let myself appear naive or at least as if I am on less firm ground, and then I flip things. It's very satisfying indeed, and often surprises others in a way that actually inspires them to think about their own thinking... I find this more satisfying and fulfilling than either taking a straightforwardly dominant stance or an earnestly disempowered stance. But I tend, when I can't manage that fun in-between, to be somewhat domineering. I'm trying to be conscious of it, though. I do not, in other words, often like to be in a submissive position unless I feel I am taking that stance for some perhaps more dominant purpose. It's almost a manipulation. For a long time I thought my BDSM urges betrayed an inner conflict surrounding submission--that secretly I wanted to submit, but I wasn't allowing myself to. That made it seem like I "really," and thus only really, needed to submit, and that I either had to learn to submit or move through and transcend the urge to submit. Now I find this story too simplistic. I am confident, contrarian, sometimes-dominating, and in many respects irredeemably male, AND I need to bow down at the feet of a deserving woman and endure/savor her abuse. It's only a conflict if I feel conflicted about it, which, these days, I mostly don't. Mostly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistress Fei Posted March 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2015 Ah, Mistress Fei, sometimes reading your words is like hearing a part of me speaking to me from without, only with your mesmerizing visage and cute voice I'm like you! Here's how I do it: I often take a contrarian stance, put myself way out on a limb, and let the other person feel they've got me cornered, then I gently pull out the rug from underneath them by complicating the picture, and presenting my "out there" stance as a critique that, when properly understood, puts their view AND itself into question. Not sure that's a very clear description, but in any case you've already described it quite well. I let myself appear naive or at least as if I am on less firm ground, and then I flip things. It's very satisfying indeed, and often surprises others in a way that actually inspires them to think about their own thinking... I find this more satisfying and fulfilling than either taking a straightforwardly dominant stance or an earnestly disempowered stance. But I tend, when I can't manage that fun in-between, to be somewhat domineering. I'm trying to be conscious of it, though. I do not, in other words, often like to be in a submissive position unless I feel I am taking that stance for some perhaps more dominant purpose. It's almost a manipulation. For a long time I thought my BDSM urges betrayed an inner conflict surrounding submission--that secretly I wanted to submit, but I wasn't allowing myself to. That made it seem like I "really," and thus only really, needed to submit, and that I either had to learn to submit or move through and transcend the urge to submit. Now I find this story too simplistic. I am confident, contrarian, sometimes-dominating, and in many respects irredeemably male, AND I need to bow down at the feet of a deserving woman and endure/savor her abuse. It's only a conflict if I feel conflicted about it, which, these days, I mostly don't. Mostly So if I understand correctly, you appear more open minded at first to ease the other into sharing his/her opinion, then flip their close-mindedness into a more receptive stance? I'm into it! Now, is it only in sharing your opinions that this instinct crops up? Ah, interesting, the complexity of your dominance strikes a chord with me, I too have been thinking about my incredibly fluctuating sense of dominance, and the intricacies within it. I've recently been thinking about the idea of simplicity, how NOTHING, and i mean absolutely nothing is what it seems- everything is a combination of paradoxes, overcompensations, and opposites- the liar is the most honest of all type of stuff- often I'm questioned as to why I invest my time in a certain person that might not seem appealing to others for whatever purpose he/she is serving, but I know deep down that what's presented is often masking its very contradictory instinct that takes time and effort to uncover. It's at the Fortress we are really exposed to these clear-cut opposites- the most submissive and docile in the playroom might not, and usually is not at all that way in life. For me, I've found this playing out in different ways.. it's always the person I feel the most with that I'm unable to communicate those feelings to, that I might act the most blasé towards. It's the text message that takes me days to respond to, that might look like I didn't care when really, I cared so much and that's why it took me so long. I'm glad there are people like you who exhibit and understand these hidden binaries so that I know at least we're not all being looked at in such a singular way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistress Fei Posted March 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2015 I learned from a very young age (as many children do), how to get what I want. I recognized that their is an art to it and took to it in terms of "experimenting" with people's emotions (oh, I can press buttons). I feel I have always had a great intuition and empathic ability with people and have used their characteristics sadistically against them in a passive way. For example, playing on someone's fear, anger, aggression, jealousy, wants/desires, etc...This is what I mean by manipulate. As I got older and wiser in the business world, I felt uncomfortable so blatantly using people's emotions against them. So I further honed the skill using what is broadly taught in business schools as "negotiating" tactics. There are four really simple principles here that go very deep: 1. Know what you want to achieve really want to achieve. (The end game) 2. Know what the other person wants to achieve in a particular context and more broadly 3. Know the power map of who's who and the interactions between them (common goals, alliances, aggresor's, etc...) 4. Know the personality styles of the people involved Use the information wisely. Goal oriented: A. Can everyone win? If you can make their goal equal your goal then life is easy B. Can the right people win? Maybe not everyone but the majority. This is not too hard to achieve C. Can you convince people the goals are the same when they are not? This is where I end up most often. It actually is easier than it sounds. Words are so malleable. C. All out total destruction. Flame people to the ground to achieve what you want. BUT! you better be right. If you are right, you are untouchable, if you are wrong, well say goodbye to achieving a second objective. I have done this a very rare few times and it is scary when everyone is out to get you, but it is the biggest high imaginable when you get your way and time demonstrates it was the right move and answer. Your respect quotient goes through the roof. What is manipulative about it is, it can be a selfish game of achieving power, position, money and it can be a lonely game too (no one is really your friend). Many companies including the one I work at has a "shark" mentality. Also known as "up or out". Meaning you move up or you are fired. I have very specific examples, but should not write them here (this site is google indexed). Maybe one day in person I will share them with you Best metaphor for it is think House of Cards. It is actually pretty realistic to the real world. Influence to me is achieving more higher plane objectives and goals in life through teaching rather than manipulating. Instead of manipulating a child to do the right thing by giving them chocolate for doing something right, you teach them why something is right and help them to make the best decision so they reward themselves. This I learned through a very special person. It should theoretically work at work as well, but the reality of it is so many people enable the bad behaviors that after attempting to influence and objective after objective fails I need to fall back on what works in an environment where deadlines matter. Sometimes I get lucky and influence works and it feels so powerfully positive to pass on. They say the best leaders influence. And I half believe in that. It is one of those all or nothing statements and there is never absolute truth in such a thing. wow- are there books you can recommend on the subject? or was this mostly trial and error i've read books on power and manipulation/game theory but they tend to be very abstract and not as methodical as you've presented Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey Posted March 22, 2015 Report Share Posted March 22, 2015 Superior Mistress Fei, I have a dual nature when it comes to this. I am very submissive toward women but when it comes to men I tend to be very dominant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loveinthetimeofcollaring Posted March 23, 2015 Report Share Posted March 23, 2015 What are your thoughts on power, your preferred role of power- whether it be dominant/submissive? Do you prefer to always be in control (how do you go about maintaining your continual control?) or do you prefer a turn-the-tables scenario like I outlined above? When dealing with friends/relationships/work, I usually find myself in a more dominant position but I'm not exactly sure it's my "preferred" role. In many cases--some friendships and colleagues especially--there's simply a power vacuum, where either no one wants to have that dominant position or the people who do are somehow toxic to others. My tolerance for those kinds of things is pretty low and, as such, I will assume a more dominant/powerful position to steer the overall group away from a "broken" situation. I do love a turn-the-tables scenario though! Personally I love a delta in information/understanding and the sort of dynamics that creates--having information/knowledge someone else would use to make a decision and thus altering their actions is oddly entertaining :] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistress Fei Posted March 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 Superior Mistress Fei, I have a dual nature when it comes to this. I am very submissive toward women but when it comes to men I tend to be very dominant. why? what is it you believe about women? vs men? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistress Fei Posted March 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 Why thank you Mistress Fei. Maybe I should write a book You have given me inspiration! I can recommend some books. Let me look through my collection. I can let you borrow a few too if you would like. Certainly learning social styles is one element such as Meyers Briggs, Tracom (http://www.tracomcorp.com/solutions/by-element/social-style/), and Archetypes. You are probably very familiar with these already. One book I particularly liked, well his videos primarily, is Mahan Khalsa's Let's Get Real or Not Play. As you pointed out, most of the books are a bit conceptual, high level, and very cheery. The hard core stuff you learn by trial and error. awesome!! i am going to get Khalsa's book and would love to borrow a few you select- would like to know what's going on in your head when it's not covered by MZ's pretty undies yes i've come to realize it's important to look at the individual as an individual- the biggest mistake is to assume everyone operates the same way i've always had a very natural ability to sense someone's weaknesses, strengths, general character, relationship dynamics, some other psychic intuitions, due to my abilities as an empath that, with my psych background, allows me to create a cognitive map of the person once i interact with them and i rarely ever forget anything when it comes to someone who's gotten my attention this last year has been me learning how to apply that knowledge instead of just letting it stew as a collection of amorphous thoughts about a person you all have been very helpful with that endeavor i cannot thank everyone enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistress Fei Posted March 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 When dealing with friends/relationships/work, I usually find myself in a more dominant position but I'm not exactly sure it's my "preferred" role. In many cases--some friendships and colleagues especially--there's simply a power vacuum, where either no one wants to have that dominant position or the people who do are somehow toxic to others. My tolerance for those kinds of things is pretty low and, as such, I will assume a more dominant/powerful position to steer the overall group away from a "broken" situation. I do love a turn-the-tables scenario though! Personally I love a delta in information/understanding and the sort of dynamics that creates--having information/knowledge someone else would use to make a decision and thus altering their actions is oddly entertaining :] interesting- yes true, i know the vacuum you're referring to sometimes it feels better to take the hit for the group, for the sake of the group even if you don't feel up to it- that's what i think HA do you have an example?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 I believe women are superior to men thus I have a tendency to be more respectful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistress Fei Posted March 26, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 Haha. I would like to know the same thing. LOL I am grateful for your kind words. I have a lot in common with you, based on what you have posted. I have the same memory affliction it is a blessing and a curse! I have Khalsa's book. I will bring that one and maybe another one I have in mind to my next session on Monday and leave them with whoever is running the office that day for you to pick up. Yes it absolutely is- sometimes ive learned to play dumb so as to not freak the other person out! it can be extremely flattering in some circumstances however. and used wisely, can be very powerful to have a reserve of knowledge on the other especially if they don't have the best memory yes i think so too, seems we like to ponder about the same concepts awesome! appreciate it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loveinthetimeofcollaring Posted March 26, 2015 Report Share Posted March 26, 2015 HA do you have an example?! Let's see... Most of my examples are work examples, which are pretty boring. A (slightly) less boring example would be the dinner I had with a friend my fiancee a few weeks ago. This is a new friend and he's nice, if a little stiff, and is originally from a very rural state. At some point we're talking about New York and he begins to go on about people from NYC--it's here I realize he doesn't know I was born in Brooklyn. So, basically, I egg him on to share all of his negative stereotypes: accents, rudeness, inability to appreciate aspects of nature, on and on and on. I wait until he's exhausted himself to reveal the truth and just get a big laugh watching him try to get his foot out of his mouth. I didn't take anything he said personally and told him not to worry, but it was fun luring him out on a ledge with that information gap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistress Fei Posted March 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 Let's see... Most of my examples are work examples, which are pretty boring. A (slightly) less boring example would be the dinner I had with a friend my fiancee a few weeks ago. This is a new friend and he's nice, if a little stiff, and is originally from a very rural state. At some point we're talking about New York and he begins to go on about people from NYC--it's here I realize he doesn't know I was born in Brooklyn. So, basically, I egg him on to share all of his negative stereotypes: accents, rudeness, inability to appreciate aspects of nature, on and on and on. I wait until he's exhausted himself to reveal the truth and just get a big laugh watching him try to get his foot out of his mouth. I didn't take anything he said personally and told him not to worry, but it was fun luring him out on a ledge with that information gap You are horrible Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loveinthetimeofcollaring Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 You are horrible (thank you) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sissyrobbi Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 once on an episode of CSI (the original series) Grisom visited a Dungeon and at one point in the episode he said to the Mistress .. "the submissive is the one in control" hmmmm ... that was years ago and i still reflect on it ... pensive thought Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waitingblindfolded Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Yes it absolutely is- sometimes ive learned to play dumb so as to not freak the other person out! it can be extremely flattering in some circumstances however. and used wisely, can be very powerful to have a reserve of knowledge on the other especially if they don't have the best memory yes i think so too, seems we like to ponder about the same concepts awesome! appreciate it! Hello my Goddess. What did you think of our session last night? Yours, Michael... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistress Fei Posted April 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2015 Hello my Goddess. What did you think of our session last night? Yours, Michael... Hello Michael, more like, what did YOU think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistress Fei Posted April 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2015 once on an episode of CSI (the original series) Grisom visited a Dungeon and at one point in the episode he said to the Mistress .. "the submissive is the one in control" hmmmm ... that was years ago and i still reflect on it ... pensive thought yup, binaries, oppositions, contradictions are inherent in everything, especially something so complex as domination Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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